Hello all,

This is my first time here. I hope my question is considered to be plumbing related.

The outside tap on my house was of the frost free variety (aqua-dynamic) where the spigot, back plate/wall plate and pipe into the house are all one unit. This tap ended up freezing somehow so I just had it replaced with a normal tap with copper pipe (1/2" into the house. Unfortunately I wasn't watching the plumber do the outside work and he put in the new tap without a back plate. When I asked him about it he told me I can get a split or two piece Escutcheon and he gave me a link to a split type from Home Depot. Unfortunately it's plastic and from what I was told is only rated for indoor use. The folks at Home Depot don't think it will hold up to the abuses of being outdoors. They don't even think the finish will last for one season.

Can anyone recommend one for outdoors? Home Depot didn't seem to have any but I'm in Canada so maybe there's less of a selection up here and all the ones I found online seem to be for indoors. OR.... do I have to pull the spigot off and put a proper plate on?

I have a picture of my tap but don't know how to post it from my hard drive.

Thanks for any help provided.


Karen

They make hinged metal flanges, but since they are steel, they will eventually rust and have to be replaced.

As long as the penetration of the pipe thru the wall is waterproof, the escutcheon is aesthetic only. You can purchase a metal split escutcheon but it will probably be chromed steel and rust out in a few years.

to post pictures here are the instructions.

[www.plbg.com]

Thank you all for the speedy replies and thanks for providing the link for posting images. I already read this but missed the most important part.. #1 where you can post your images to link to. LOL

So here are my images.

This image is of the old tap (frost free). This is an aqua-dynamic so the tap, back plate/wall plate and pipe through the wall are all one piece so unfortunately I can't reuse the back plate. Ugh!
[@#$%&[postimg.cc]][/url]

This image of my new tap
[@#$%&[postimg.cc]][/url]

Questons:
1. Forgive me in not knowing the correct terminology for things but originally I was searching split or two piece escutcheons but I get a sense these are only meant for indoor use (they were all plastic). Should I be searching for flanges?

2. Is it better that I have this redone and have a proper back plate put on. I've seen ones that look like they're meant to slip on over the pipe before the spigot is put on? If so can anyone recommend a good one?

Thanks again!



Edited 3 times.

Sorry for how the images turned out. I put the URLs in exactly as per the instructions but it gave me broken images. I just copied the url that postimg.cc provided so at least they show up.

sorry but that is not an outside faucet. it will function as one but that is not it's intended purpose.
the way that is installed, there is no way to secure it to the wall.
a few tugs on the hose and it may just pull away from the copper pipe.
a real hose faucet looks like this with two slots to attach screws.

Thank you Packy!!!!! Now I know why I was seeing some taps with back plates (through google searches). I guess they are true outdoor taps.

So what is this type used for? Is this an indoor faucet or is it used in a different manner outside?

I guess I will be getting that plumber back to rectify this.

Thanks again! I'm really glad I joined this forum!!


Karen

I forgot to mention... the plumber (and he is supposedly licensed) told me he usually extends the water pipe out a bit from the wall so it's easier to put things under the tap (like a bucket). He said sometimes if the tap is right against the wall (like my original frost free) then getting a bucket under it if you don't have a hose might not work. Realistically though you can just use a hose to fill the bucket if that's the case (I suppose). :-D

they might be called different things in different parts of the country but most commonly they are called "boiler drain".

[www.lowes.com]

unless the 'plumber' is fixing this for free, I would call a different plumber.. 'nuff said.

I have one more question:
The original frost free pipe was probably close to double the size of the new pipe so the hole left behind is obviously bigger than the new pipe. The plumber who did this job packed the hole with some left over copper pipe to make sure the water pipe doesn't move.

If I have him come back to redo this is what he did acceptable or is there a better way to pack (and insulate I guess) the hole. Should I just make sure he uses foam assuming that a proper tap will be installed that is secure to the wall or should it be packed with something other than foam?

And if someone (Packy?) let me know what these taps are used for that would be great. I used a company here in Canada that I'm a member of (Home Service Club) that guarantees all the work so if something is done incorrectly Home Service Club has to pay to have someone fix it (either the original contractor or another one). I want to document that the wrong tap was used but want to say what the tap is meant to be used for (ex: it's meant for indoor taps like a basement sink).

Thanks again!!


Karen

Thanks again Packy. I posted another question before seeing your reply. Yes, I think I came across references to boiler drain while searching for taps.

Can you advise on what I should pack the hole with (see my previous reply). The old frost free pipe that went through the wall is much bigger than the new copper pipe so the plumber packed the hole with left over copper pipe to secure the water pipe so it doesn't move? Is this good enough if I get him to come back and put a proper tap on that is secured to the wall or should it be packed with something else (maybe just insulating foam)?

Thanks again!!


Karen

any reason why you didn't replace with another frost free hose bib? This one may freeze when winter comes around again.

I think your plumber did you a disservice by not having a conversation with you first before replacing the faucet. You originally had a year-round frost-free wall hydrant. You ended up with a warm weather faucet that you’ll have to remember to drain each fall. As for filling the annular space around the pipe, if it was me I’d use mortar since it’s a brick wall.

Sorry for the delay in responding sum (FL) and m & m (MD)

The back story to this whole situation is that this tap was moved about 15 years ago when I had the house renovated. The original tap was a regular tap but there was a shut off for it on the inside of the house so I could properly shut it down in the winter (I still have one like this in the front of my house and have never had trouble with it). When this tap was moved it was switched to a frost free on recommendation of the plumber who did the project but what I didn't realize is that he didn't install a shut off valve. I only discovered this a couple years ago when the tap started to drip and I couldn't get it to stop. I assumed it was a washer problem and when I went to shut it off via the shut off so I could replace the washer that's when I discovered there wasn't one. As a side note I just found out that our building code says a shut off is required so needless to say I'm more than irked that one wasn't put in.

Anyway the dripping got so bad the year when everything started to melt that I decided to get a few quotes to find out was was causing the dripping (and replace the tap if needed) and put a shut off in at the same time. I contacted three plumbers and they all said that due to the very cold weather we get that the frost free taps aren't good up here (they're prone to still freezing) and that I should have a regular one put back in given I planned to have a shut off installed. I agreed and given I have a regular one up front I'm used to the shut down procedure in the fall regardless.

I was actually hoping it was just a washer that was causing the problem with it dripping but as it happens when the plumber pulled the frost free out it had split in two places so something had gone wrong with it at some point. This made me think it was probably best to just do the regular tap given I was putting in the shut off. I'm sure having the shut off would have meant another frost free would be OK but I was concerned that if I put another one in and something went wrong with it I would have to have the whole thing pulled out for a second time. This way (hopefully) if something goes wrong with this one (meaning it somehow froze) then I would only have to replace the spigot part.

As it happens I'm going to have the plumber come back. The work is covered under the Home Service Club agreement so I don't have to pay again. Should I have another frost free put in or should I just have a regular tap that secures to the wall put in?

If a regular tap is fine am I looking for a sillcock or bibcock or are these pretty much the same? I found both at Home Depot but don't know if one is meant for garden taps specifically?

My other question is (which actually might sway me back to a frost free) is whether anyone knows if either a sillcock or bibcock will fit the current holes of the old frost free. I'm not sure if the back plates (flanges) on all of these are standard or whether the frost free is larger? The current dimensions I have for the old frost free are:

6-1/2" for the width (side to side) of the flange at widest point
5-1/2" distance between screws (measured from center of screw to center of other screw on the wall

Are sillcocks/bibcocks smaller than this? I would prefer to not have to drill two more holes into my mortar. Here are the two I found at Home Depot:


Sillcock: [www.homedepot.ca]
Bibcock: [www.homedepot.ca]

Thanks for any advice on this.


Karen