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Author:
NoHub (MA)
That a crack sum....have fun with that one,don't get much tighter than that.
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Author:
sum (FL)
oh boy, if that's the case and the crack seems to run all the way down to the slab, I would have to cut the slab open and chase to the end of the crack...most likely the elbow whichever it turns to?
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Author:
stuckinlodi (MO)
Because it is vertical it may have never leaked.
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Author:
steve (CA)
It a not like you're newbie to chop'n concrete.
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Author:
sum (FL)
I hate chopping concrete.
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Author:
sum (FL)
If I cut the CI pipe at some point above the lav trap arm, then remove that section. I should be able to stick a tape down to see how deep that elbow is and which way it turns. If I then drill say 3/4" diameter holes into the 4" thick slab around the perimeters of the pipe, thus making a hole all the way around the CI pipe with 3/4" clearance, will I be able to:
(1) work the cracked pipe out of the 90 elbow below, it has to be leaded in, assuming it is not too deep and I do something to prevent loose pieces from dropping in.
(2) put in a new PVC section, rubber donut connection to the elbow below and no hub connection up top.
Will there be enough room to work this without breaking slab more than the footprint of the bottom plate? I really have no spare tiles on both sides of the wall and matching tiles has failed.
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Author:
packy (MA)
sum, if you take the copper adapter out of that tee you will be able to stick a measuring tape into the pipe to tell how deep it is.
to answer your question.. yeah, you can drill out the lead and remove the cracked pipe. then replace with PVC the way you described.
while it is open, run a snake wire down to clean it and install a cleanout tee for future use.
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Author:
Don411 (IN)
Looks like you can get to the pipe easy enough by opening up the adjoining stud bay. Worst case scenario, that pipe turns away and goes under the adjacent tiled room making elbow replacement impossible. One in 4 chance LOL.
Question for the pros: Since the crack is on a vertical section, and someone pointed out that it may never have leaked due to that, what about forcing some epoxy into the crack to seal it up and then call it a day? I'm not a fan of 1/2-arsed repairs, but given the nature of the crack and what's involved to replace, is a patch an acceptable solution?
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Author:
stuckinlodi (MO)
Maybe take some no-hubs, slit them and wrap the cracked area with no-hub slit on opposite side. Stainless band tightly just in case it ever tries to leak, also prevent any possibility of odors. It's his property, doesn't have to be done to satisfy a customer he is working for, just needs to be ok with it himself. Probably been like that for years, if he hadn't opened up that particular wall he'd never known it was there yet it would have continued working forever.
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Author:
packy (MA)
my halfarsed repair would be with that hard tar they use for tar and gravel roofs.
you get a chunk of the stuff (it is hard and brittle) and heat the pipe well and rub this tar all over. it will liquify, fill in the crack and harden nicely. it is fully compatable with the tar already on ther pipe.
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Author:
Don411 (IN)
Good to Know, thanks Packy! Sum's already paid his dues busting up concrete, maybe this will save him some work.
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Author:
packy (MA)
i just found out it is called 'kettle tar'..
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Author:
sum (FL)
If I patch it with something, will the crack enlarge on the inside since the metal will continue to corrode right? Also there is a section of the crack below the slab but above the elbow that is very likely cracked and may be leaking but not visible right?
I would love to patch it if it won't get any worse. If it will continue to get worse and only buys me time I would probably try and address it now.
What about this? Once I put the tape down and have an idea of the depth of the elbow below the slab (I don't think it will be too deep...may be 8", 10", 12"...) I could make a cut say 3" above the finished floor, and replace a 24" section of this with PVC, using two no hub shielded couplings. The idea being with the pipe cut 3" above the floor, I most likely have a view and limited access to the inside of the remainder of the pipe all the way to the elbow. I may be able to clean the pipe on the inside and expose the crack on the inside, and do an epoxy repair inside using fiberglass cloth and several coats of liquid epoxy painted on the inside surface. Once that's done the crack is sealed from the inside and no moisture will be in contact with the crack and that should arrest the corrosion. Then I can do a tar patch or epoxy patch on the outside. No breaking concrete and messing with the elbow.
Would this work? That would also allow me to put in a PVC sanitary tee on this pipe and put in a PVC trap arm & stub out.
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Author:
packy (MA)
sum, it is difficult to say for sure about any repair. the thickness of the pipe is important in that decision.
i have seen some cast pipe that was cracked but the wall thickness was acceptable for leaving the pipe and making some kind of hot tar repair.
i have seen others where the pipe was literally paper thin and there was no chance of saving it.
if i was saving your pipe, i would bend the code and use an all rubber fernco. in some situations they seem to work better as they are more forgiving.
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Author:
hj (AZ)
The concrete around the pipe is probably creating a compressive force on it preventing it from cracking inside the concrete. But anywhere it is "free", corrosion in the crack will create an "immense" force on the metal causing the crack to continue, regardless of anything covering it.
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Author:
PlumberLoren (CA)
Clearly CI Pipe has a useful life and you may have reached it. Cast Iron manufactured back in those days was primitave in that the molds weren't always aligned causing one side of the pipe wall thickness to be minimal leading to weakness and often cracking. Consider replacing the CI... I realize this is not a simple solution but you may as well bite the bullet so you can sleep at night. ABS and PVC are your friend. Good luck
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Author:
sum (FL)
hj in this case I believe the cracks have already reached both ends. The top of the crack is right under the hub, I can see the bottom of the crack where it enters the slab so it's only another 8, 10, 12" to the elbow so it's pretty much the whole length of this piece. Will the crack spread "sideways"?
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Author:
hj (AZ)
not likely. The pressure tries to spread the two sides further apart.
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Author:
GordonArnold (IN)
the busting up concrete is the worst for sure....
Gordon "PlumbDawg" Arnold
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