Hi Friends,

After spending hours at Lowe's and online I remembered the good advice received a couple of years ago on this fine site!

Here's my new problem:

[www.instagram.com]

I am trying to replace an old one piece angle stop water supply valve and it's so corroded and caked in minerals I can't budge the nuts. I've soaked it in PB Blaster, tapped a straight screwdriver into the mineral muck with a hammer but nothing is happening.

Does anyone have some advice?

Thanks, DIYB

You need to use 2 wrenches...one on the valve body and one on the nut. If you set them right, you can use one hand and squeeze. Make sure the wrenches are adjusted correctly, or fit correctly, if using open-end wrenches. You don't want to strip the parts.

Since we do not know if you are trying to loosen the correct nuts or turning them the proper way, we have to guess. But, my experience has been that with the proper wrenches the compression nut WILL loosen.

I understand the proper direction for release is clockwise for the compression nut in the back and counter clockwise for the nut in the front, although nothing is moving but that is the direction I am pushing.

Using 2 wrenches?

This darn thing is original to the house circa 1979. I replaced the valves for the toilets 10 years ago (should have done them all ) This one being under the bathroom sink with hardly any room to move - and my weakling hands - is proving more difficult for sure. Can't turn the H2o back on until I get it fixed, YIKES!!

YES

Try to orient the handles of the 2 wrenches so they're, a hand-grip apart, and move the parts in the right direction when you squeeze them.

There is so much mineral buildup I think I was using too big of wrenches and they slipped a bit which I mistook for movement. I tried to tap off some of the minerals and went down a size in wrenches which resulted in a tighter (proper) fit. No more slipping, but no movement.

I put the old valve back together, turned the H2o back on and the valve is holding. Unfortunately the water supply line nut on the cold side experienced a cracked gasket (who designed this crap anyway?), so I won't be able to use this sink until both supplies are replaced. Can you guys check your calendars and see when hell freezes over next?

The dude at Lowe's sold me a Handle and Puller Kit, but what good is that? Is it even an option under these circumstances?



Edited 1 times.

Save the receipt, and take that back.

Yeah, and the packaging that is currently in 20 pieces... They're good about taking stuff back at least.

I think I am simply not physically strong enough to break the lock

Do you think there is any hope with applying heat or soaking the thing in CLR or white vinegar?

Ask someone for help. It will come off.

I can't tell from picture but some one piece angle stops have a steel nut which are really tough to loosen. If you have limited access to turn wrenches or don't want to put too much stress on copper pipe/fittings you have to split the compression nut with a Dremel type tool with metal cut off wheel (disc). It takes a delicate touch so that you do not damage the copper pipe. If you don't have a Dremel you could use a hacksaw blade, but it is pain to do. Good Luck.

I would suggest removing the flex hose connected at the bottom, simply to give you more room to position the two wrenches at more favorable positions to untighten.

Save the sleeve puller, you might need it later once you have the valve off, to remove the ferrule if you decide not to reuse that corroded compression nut.

1. with a 'jab saw' cut the corrugated supply flush with the stop body - the kind of saw that holds a hacksaw blade

2. using a good quality combination wrench WEDGE a hold back on the rear compression nut - put the wrench (hopefully a 'tap on' fit) horizontally out to the left - cut a scrap 2x3 to be a 'jam fit' vertically under wrench (wrench to bottom of cabinet) - you are resisting the following counterclockwise force:

3. using a 14 or 18" pipe wrench turn the valve body CCW - it WILL unscrew


are you done yet?

==============================================

"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638

Depending on WHICH "handle and puller kit" he sold you it is either useless or you use it AFTER you get the valve off.

Given the amount of friction between the valve and the sleeve, I doubt that the valve, itself, will even unscrew "first" and it will probably twist the copper tubing before it happens. Work on the nut until you get it loose.

I've got a little saw that will do the trick, a good, strong combo wrench, and a 14" pipe wrench - all thanks to my step dad who recently passed and I saved his tools! Thanks Bruno!!

I'll find some wood or something equally strong in it's place a bit later today and go for it!! I'll check back afterwards.

This sounds like I might be able to do it - if so, that will be sweet as the plumber across the street wants $650 (that's with the neighborhood discount) to do three lav's with the new faucets I purchased. The home warranty crooks sent him, small world. He claims he can't replace the faucets under the warranty as he can fix the leak by putting a 30 cent part in a 40 year old piece of crap Valley faucet. Now why would I pay $125 (deductible) for that??

I saw this particular puller on a youtube video with the "claw" ends behind the compression nut in the rear. I can't imagine that it would have much effect against the amount of mineral deposit cementing the nut on.

One thing I'm not sure of is if the front "nut" with the built in copper tubing protruding from the bottom is actually fixed or removable if the corrosion is breached.

I am wary of that outcome as well. If in fact I am successful in jamming a wood stop under the holding wrench it seems like if I see any movement of the rear wrench I'd know to stop as that would indicate twisting of the underlying copper pipe.

Any thoughts on that? Thanks,

1. $650 MAY be a good number depending on how difficult it is to remove the old faucets and valves
2. WHO gives a "neighborhood discount"? ( I have "one price" and it is the same for everyone)
3. You must have a very poor "home warranty", because I have never heard of one with a $125.00 deductible.
4. It seems he makes all his repairs to the "least effort possible", if all he does is "repair" the stop.

I would not even try it in the first place.

It rotates "freely" around the copper tubing and it is what a "proper puller" would pull against to slide the compression sleeve off of the tubing.

If your angle stop had a white plastic cup-shaped handle it is quite possible that the valve does not have a standard compression thread but rather a coarse 1/2" IPS sized nut. If so you will need to pull the old nut or search for a coarse thread stop, they are a bit uncommon. I have only seem them with a 3/8" compression outlet.

Cut the pipe right behind the valve with a tubing cutter and replace the shut-off with one that has a shark bite connection to the copper pipe.

You won't care if the "front nut" is removable.

You want a tight hold on the back nut, a tight hold on the front nut, then turn the front wrench counterclockwise relative to the back wrench. I don't think any wood blocking would help. Try to hold one steady and turn the other, if it doesn't work, try the reverse direction to see if it will go a nanometer in the opposite direction the reverse back, sometimes that helps.

Once you remove the valve body, push the back nut against the wall and use the sleeve puller to pull out the ferrule which I am guessing is strangling the copper pipe.

quote; , push the back nut against the wall and use the sleeve puller to pull out the ferrule

ALL the sleeve pullers I have seen use the "back nut" to pull the sleeve/ferrule off.



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Wow, could it really be this easy?

I went to the Shark Bite site and it seems like I could do this with the 1/2" X 3/8" Compression Angle Stop23036-0000LF . I was unable to determine what length of copper pipe is necessary to attach the Shark Bite. It looks like there will be less than an inch of pipe left after the "operation", and that's assuming I don't muck it up.

Here is the link to an image of the side view of my angle stop: [www.instagram.com]

Perhaps it will be necessary to cut out some of the cabinet back to gain access to more of the pipe. Can that be done? I could invest in a dremel or just use a hacksaw blade.

Any thoughts? I've got 10 water supply angle stops to replace. This one is about the worst, on some of the others I may be able to remove the old one-piece stop. Even so, the installation of the Shark Bite looks quick and Blonde Proof (to the degree that is possible). I'd rather cut 10 pipes and pop one of these on than spend 5 days trying to remove 10 corroded old stops all the while banging my head, slicing my hands, breaking my nails and on and on...



Edited 2 times.

I would use compression stops and not sharkbites. I do not believe sharkbite requires less copper lengthwise to seat. It might require more because if you ever need to release the sharkbite you need a sliver of space to insert that orNge horseshoe thingie and room for your finger to press.

If you intend to put in escutchoen you need another 1/4" additional.

Have fun.

A sharkbite fitting needs just under 1" of insertion depth:

[www.sharkbite.com]

There's not going to be 1/2" of pipe sticking thru the wall if she uses tubing cutters to cut the valve off. She needs to use bigger wrenches to remove that valve.

NO MODERN JUNK, PLEASE

650 bucks to remove and replace 10 stops INCLUDING parts seems like a fair price if the situation is the same for all stops

one would want 1/4 turn 'ball type' stops + 'puttied' escutcheons for the bucks + braided/shielded supplies

or

more WHEATIES or bigger wrenches

==============================================

"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638



Edited 1 times.

steve, that's true. The issue is if and when the fitting needs to be disconnected in the future, then having little to no room between the wall and the fitting makes it a challenge. Ideally I would still want 1/2" left over pipe after the fitting is put on to allow for room to put a disconnect tool behind it and a wrench to apply back pressure to release the collar.

The $650 was only for two sinks, to replace water supplies and install the new faucets I already purchased and insert new gaskets behind the old Valley cartridge of one shower (which I can do myself and I already have the parts). To do all four sinks was $980

Aye Carumba!!

not a 'good' price, but still 'in the ballpark'


use your 14 wrench wedged for a holdback and use an 18 to 'go for it' - the 'blocking' on the holdback will allow you to '2 hand' the 18


EAT SOME WHEATIES FIRST

==============================================

"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638

Sometimes REMOVING the old valves, supplies, and faucets, can be the hardest, and most expensive, part of the job. Without seeing what you have we cannot tell it that would have increased the price to that extent.

I realize that a sharkbite is not ideal and it's not the way I would do it in my own home. But for a DIYer in a pinch, it's a reasonable solution.

It looks like there's an inch available if it's cut with a hacksaw flush with the chrome compression nut (and all the burrs are cleaned off). If & when it needs to be removed, I know that I could get it off somehow, maybe with a couple of butter knives. Or maybe that would be the time to open a little sheetrock and extend the copper.

I've been using Dahl stops for years for their superior quality. My only issue is the depth of the recess for 1/2" copper pipe. Most common existing valves are Brasscraft. When replacing BC with Dahl, while retaining existing ferrule & nut, the lack of depth in the Dahl causes the ferrule to be moved to meet the Dahl stop. I've had issues getting a seal especially if previous stop was over tightened. If there's excess pipe no problem. Even with ferrule removal tool, the pipe can be too distorted to get a seal. Please leave excess length stub outs during construction

Sharkbite will rarely safely work after ferrule & nut have been removed. Pipe is too distorted