Hello. We just hired a plumber to rough in hot and cold copper supply lines and a 1.5" drain to where we intend to have a bar sink. They were easily tied in to supply lines and a drain line close below in the basement. The tie in is only about 6 to 8 feet away. After the job was done I realized that the pitch for the drain line was actually going upwards rather than downwards. As shocking as this was, we got the plumber back to fix it.

I expected him to cut out his work and start over, but sadly, he just yanked on the run and the cemented joints to try to create the opposite pitch. With force, a ceiling strap, and loose boards precariously stacked on a floor joist near where the sink will go, he got it pitching in the proper direction. However, the stub coming up through the floor to where the bar sink will go is not vertical but tilted about 30 degrees. He's supposed to come back to hook up the sink when it's in, and he said he would fix the angle when he does, but in order to get my sink cabinet over the stub I assume that I will need to twist the PVC run even more so that it stays vertical in the cabinet.

I want this installation to last, so will the cemented joints hold up over decades with all of this twisting and tugging?

Also, he used flexible copper for the supply lines, and there are two small kinks in the cold line about 2" apart from one another at the angle coming up through the floor for the stub. How big can kinks be without problems?

Thank you!



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no permit nor inspection????

You hired a person who CLAIMED to be a plumber.

Is he/she licensed, bonded, and insured?

Perhaps you can avail yourself in the future when your shoes need resoleing.

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"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638

Nothing about the installation sounds correct. Back pitched drains, kinked water lines, crooked risers.

I hear what you're all saying. I'm disgusted myself. He is actually a 2nd generation plumber with 40 years experience. He is licensed and insured, and according to the online sites like Angie's List he has great reviews and loyal customers who wouldn't use anyone else. I can only hope that our experience was an anomaly.

Anyway, putting aside the fact that it should have been done differently, I could really use an answer, because I plan to put the cabinets in today. How much twisting and tugging can the PVC cemented joints handle? And should I be concerned about 2 dents/kinks in the soft copper line?

Thanks!



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I am not a plumber just a DIYer.

Regarding the dents and kinks in the supply lines, take a picture and post it so the pros here can see the extent of the damages.

As for the PVC drain pipes being pushed and nudged and twisted there is really no way to quantify any of it so best anyone can tell you is at most a hunch.

But I will say that if it bothers you now, it will continue to bother you AFTER the cabinets are put in, AFTER the floors are tiled, AFTER the walls are patched and finished, and even AFTER everything is done and operational you will still be wondering in the back of your mind if one of the joints may be dripping water undetected behind the walls...so if you ask me I would trade all those worries for a one day delay in your project and have that redone just for the peace of mind.

A plumber, or licensed, bonded Plumber ? Was the finished job inspected? Look at all the money you saved by going cheap. Call that "so called" plumber back and make them do it right. Sounds like a "hack" job.. I can only hope it was cheap.

Best Wishes

I am more concerned about the drain coming through the bottom of the cabinet, given his apparent lack of knowledge about good plumbing practices.

He is a licensed plumber. I don't know about bonded. I didn't even consider getting a permit or inspection. It is a small straightforward job that I could have done myself if I had the time to learn and the inclination. I don't know if he is cheap. His price for both the rough in and the later final attachment came in at less than half of another plumber we asked for a bid for just the rough in. It was two hours of work to get it wrong. He then came back and spent maybe half an hour yanking and "fixing" it on his way to another job.



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After this thread and all of you confirming how bad this is, I just left a message with the plumber that I can't live with the job as it is. Either he will cut out the drain and redo it or I will and expect a refund for a portion of the job.

I just looked again at it, and I was wrong about the 30 degree angle out of the floor. It might be 15 degrees. Whatever the angle is, it really wants to stay there and takes force to twist it to vertical.

i plead guilty to having pushed/pulled a PVC pipe to get it to align with another pipe. though no more than a few degrees. my theory is that once hot water runs thru the pipe it will relax the strain. BUT, not 15 or more degrees.

Quote

I didn't even consider getting a permit or inspection.

Therein lies your problem.

You did not bother to follow proper procedure, why should he?

If you paid him, the legal premise is that you were satisfied with the visible aspects of the work performed.

Either :

sue the butcher

or

hire a real, sober, plumber (which you should do anyway)

==============================================

"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638

I'm sure there is a proper procedure, but how is the homeowner supposed to know? Shouldn't the plumber advise us on proper procedure? And hiring a licensed plumber with 40 years experience and rave reviews should be enough, no? How much more can be expected of a homeowner?

Anyway, the plumber got back to me, and he doesn't want to do the repair. He decided to refund us $200. It was a cordial exchange. So now we need to find another plumber to fix his work. How do you know who to call?

Licensed - Bonded - Insured you check and verify.

YOU get the required building permit for the work to be done.

You do not pay more than 50% prior to Building Dept. 'signing off' on the permit for said work.

You (the homeowner) MUST become aware of WHAT needs to be done.

Neat - straight - level - plumb - clean - appears professional - STRONG - code compliant (see permit requirements) - etc.

The 'professional' determines HOW to do it.

Personally, I would ask my Insurance Agent for a recommended vendor - NOT 'angies list' or equivalent.

==============================================

"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638