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Author:
stillwatergirl (MN)
My second floor shower has been leaking into the ceiling below-a very small, slow drip but enough to soak through the sheetrock. I've had 2 plumbers and a contractor crawling all over and no one can figure it out. The plumbers say it is the tile/grout because they can't find a leaky pipe, but I've performed every possible test and sealed up every possible seam and it still leaks. They also told me there was no pan installed, so the contractor told me I should have the entire thing stripped down to the studs and redo it, at a cost of $2,500. I am not comfortable with this since no one has identified the actual problem! Plus the plumbers were wrong, because a tile guy came to look at it for a bid, and told me that my drain was the type used with a pan. Which led me to wonder how 2 plumbers missed that!?
Here's where I am today: My tile is older and can't be matched, which means a complete tear-out if it is a tile issue. However, I wonder if this could be a leaking drain? I have plugged the drain and let several inches of water stand in the shower for 2 days, with no leaks. But when the shower head is turned on, water begins to trickle down into the ceiling below after approx. 5 minutes. I thought if there was a leak in the flange of the shower drain, maybe it wouldn't leak when I drained the standing water because that was all down in about a minute. But when we shower, water is dripping down consistently for anywhere from 5 (me) to 20 (my daughter) minutes. And if you take gravity into account, the water draining from the showerhead is more likely to cling to the sides of the pipe, whereas a large amount of water gets sucked quickly down. Can anyone give me some guidance before I start spending huge amounts of money?? Any help will be GREATLY appreciated!
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Author:
North Carolina Plumber (NC)
I would test the trim plate ,shower faucet and piping. If you plugged the drain and let water sit there for 2 days then I would assume the drain and pan are ok. Cap the shower arm and turn the faucet on, splash water around the faucet trim, keep testing you'll find where it's coming from.
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Author:
packy (MA)
as suggested, remove the shower head and cap the shower arm. turn on the water. of course nothing will come out but so too nothing should leak below either.
if this doesn't cause a leak then it has to be in the tile, caulking or shower trim.
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Author:
stillwatergirl (MN)
Thanks guys, but all those things have been checked. Also the leak occurs even when the shower heads are pointed down below those things and left running. The plumbers insist it isn't a plumbing problem. But when I look in the drain assembly and gently scrape a screwdriver along the side just below the drain body, I come up with a bunch of gritty residue that looks like crumbling plumber's putty. I found a site online with an assembly diagram showing that the drain gasket is below the pan. If the drain gasket was leaking, this seems to explain my problem.
There are 2 shower heads--1 on each side. Running either one for about 5 minutes results in the slow drip. But dumping 2 5-gallon buckets down the drain produces no drip. If you factor in gravity, it is logical to me that fast-moving liquid that is gone in about a minute wouldn't create a drip, while a sheet of water clinging to the sides of the drain assembly and gasket would in fact create this kind of drip. I'm thinking that replacing the gasket and drain body could do the trick, and this website [www.handymanhowto.com] has the instructions on how to do it. This would be far less expensive than a complete tear-out, which I hate doing when so far no one has an answer. It's like prescribing chemo to a patient who has a stomach ache of unknown origin--it just doesn't make sense to me.
Edited 2 times.
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Author:
packy (MA)
if you stuffed something in the drain and left 2 inches of water stand there for 2 days and it did not leak, the drain is not the problem.
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Author:
stillwatergirl (MN)
I put a plug on top of the drain. It wouldn't have exposed the area between the plug and trap to any water.
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Author:
stillwatergirl (MN)
Sorry, I'm new to this forum stuff so posted my reply in the wrong place at first. The plug rested on top of the drain, so the area between the plug and the trap (which includes the gasket) was not exposed to water during that time.
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Author:
KCRoto (MO)
Are there separate shower valves for each shower head, or a separate diverter valve to control the flow? Is there any way to access under the shower to verify your theory?
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Author:
stillwatergirl (MN)
KCRoto, that is a very good question. Neither plumber mentioned that so I'm not sure. I know that I can turn one shower head on, then turn on the other one, and there is no change in pressure--does that help? My house is over 100 years old, and this bathroom is about 15 years old (done 5 years before I bought the house). Access to pipes is limited, though there is an access on one side via the attic (story-and-a-half house with knee walls on this level). There is no access under the shower. One plumber cut a hole in the ceiling below where the leak was coming through, but all we can see is the plywood base, surrounding studs, and some pipes that have been verified to not be leaking.
I think I'll stuff a rag into the drain pipe below the gasket and run water into the shower until I get a couple of standing inches. Then if I see a drip start, that should be pretty good confirmation, right?
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Author:
KCRoto (MO)
Was the access hole cut where the leak appeared? When I asked about one or two valves, when you operate the valve to turn on, do you leave that valve on and turn a second knob to make the water come out from the second shower head? Can you run the shower heads at two separate temperatures?
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Author:
stillwatergirl (MN)
I can run the shower heads at 2 separate temperatures, KCRoto. But it doesn't matter--your former question about whether I'd tested my theory motivated me to do that. I stuffed a rag in below the gasket and filled the shower floor with water. After just a few minutes, I went downstairs and found that it was already dripping. So the gasket is definitely the issue. You just helped me save $2,000 and the huge headache of pulling out and reinstalling a fully-tiled shower! All I need to do now is remove the shower floor and drain body to replace the gasket and reseal, then re-tile the floor. I knew nothing about plumbing going into this but I'm pretty tenacious when it comes to saving money! Thanks to all who responded to my post. I love collaboration and think we all learn from it-I know I did! P.S. I will hire a professional to do the plumbing work, but not the plumbers who were here before.
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Author:
KCRoto (MO)
I am certainly glad you found the leak!
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Author:
hj (AZ)
The "Drain used with a pan" does NOT necessarily mean there IS one, but finding if there is a pan can be difficult depending on how the shower was constructed.
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Author:
stillwatergirl (MN)
You're right about that, hj. I'm not prepared to dig deep enough to see if there is a pan (there is no access as it is a second-floor bathroom and the bedroom below has a plaster ceiling), but think that if I stop the leak, there is no need. It was fine for 10 years, and I will be here another 3. I just can't see spending $2,500 at this point.
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