Hello, I purchased an old farmhouse. Septic guy came out and said septic was newish, pvc in and out and in great shape. But, after running some water through it with hose, some water came back into basement right at stub-in under foundation.

Stuck 4 foot level in and set small level on end to check slope. Flat level or just slightly sloping down, and out that is.

House was abandon for some 25 years. Looks like the foundation on the wall were the sewer pipe is, sank or settled perhaps 3/4" to 1".

Looked down it with flashlight and about six or so feet in was a clump of, let's call it, an old clump of soil buildup. This was somewhat blocking flow. Sprayed more water down, got some of it to go. Nasty sludge like.

To me, it looks like the previous owner had the problem of not enough slope and this partial block was evidence of the problem of years past?

I am going to run a piece of 1" poly or pvc to clean the stuff completely out. It migth help but, it might not be enough as with previous owner, is what I am thinking???

I can't really afford to excavate and repair, so here is my question:

P.S. All plumbing is gutted in entire house now.

Can I slip 3" PVC into the 4" pvc and shim the PVC at the stub going out to increase slope enough to flow the 10' feet or so to the septic? How will this affect the rest of the plumbing?

What can I do? Is it sound?

Thank you in advance.

LN

Why not first get your indoor plumbing up and running and find out how the system works? You may find it does all right with an occassional stoppage. With the tank only 10' from the house, you have already proven that it is not too difficult to clean the line with a length of pipe, etc. from the basement cleanout. Plus, if funds are tight, it is also the most cost effective.

I agree. Unless the slope is really, really bad it is fairly easy to keep a 10 foot run of plastic pipe open and flowing. Even if the line is completely flat, or even slightly uphill, the water from normal usage is enough to keep it open provided that you can moderate the tp usage and get anyone that is particularly heavy handed to limit their usage. I assume from your description that this goes out the wall of the house to the tank? The only real solution to return the pitch if the house has settled is to cut the wall above the pipe so that you can raise it up inside the house/foundation wall. But like M&M said, try it out first and see if it really is a problem.

DITTO

and

DITTO

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"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638

That is great advice I really needed. I did think about hammer drilling above the pipe to releave pressure and perhaps shim with a pressure treated 1"x4" board to raise stub a little, perhaps.

4' or so, tapping in with a big hammer? I thought about cutting a v at the end of board and even angling the v like a boat nose to keep it up along the PVC as it goes into soil? Imagination might be getting the best of me here?

Really great that I found you folks. This really was quite depressing yesterday after removing the pipe to stub and finding this out.

Thank You,

Lex



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Go for it if it makes you feel proactive. With any other kind of pipe material, you would probably be looking at issues, but with PVC and a short run, I think you'll be fine.

If I were doing it I would remove some soil above before attempting to force the pipe up that much.

Thanks again. I slid the 1 inch poly through the pipe, until all was scraped through. I was then able to use spray hose to clean. Got only a little water back now.

Soil dam was only about 4 feet in. I was able to run a tape into pipe and catch on pipe end lip. Total length of pipe is 8 feet exactly.

Slid in 4' level again and rested my good short level on the end of the 4' level. Bubble is on the "right" line exactly, so I have a little slope going out.

Still must have a little bulge out there from settling or a rock or something causing this?

With the new level results and better flow, I proceeded to clean stub, primed and stuck a 4" cleanout, straight on.

The next piece was a short six inch section for the drain. Real close quarters and not much room to work with, so I am going to put drain 4" x 4" x 2" fitting on this. I have not much slope to work with and need this to be sublevel, of course. I glued the six inch all the way in and held it up until it set.

Question: In case this attempt is not successfull, Can I cheat a little with a greater slope than 1/4" from here, straight on to stack, about 4.5 feet?

Also, about a foot past the drain fitting, I was going to run a 4" sweep to the original toilet, about four feet to the same side as drain. This is almost exactly the same as original configuration.

Do I dare try for a little more slope to stack? Stack is only about six feet straight in from stub in. If this fails, I am thinking, I may salvage some work???

LN

Additional Questions.

Pandora's Box is opening.

My basement toilet is planned to run into sewer line ahead of Stack. Do I need to vent this toilet?

Question 2: All new plumbing, including modern toilets, perhaps three before I am all done. two for now. Folks on another forum are saying that one needs to go with all 3 inch when using new type toilets, as they do not flow enough in 4" to move soil because of less water usage? Please advise.

Thanks,

LN



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Re: Question #2.......And they believe that everyone that has an older home, and installed a modern toilet has also replaced their 4" with 3?

I started thinking the same thing. At this point, I can run my toilets with 3" if it will work better or is recommended. I have purchased one Kohler Cimmeron elongated right hight. I think it is 1.4 gallons.

As to the venting of my proposed basement toilet, wouldn't the stack w/vent that is some two feet away, act the same? But, if I need to vent the basement toilet seperately, how would I vent it?

LN

the vent for the new toilet will prevent it from syphoning when an upstairs toilet is flushed.
check with your local codes to see of an AAV is allowed.

I was reading, because of the closeness this toilet is to the main stack/vent, venting is not needed. But I think venting is best. Concrete is all hammered out, so should not be a problem.

Again, stack about 6 feet away from proposed toilet, with vent on top, should be able to tie right in with 2" vent. Second toilet is just above, about four feet from this toilet with pipe running within site of this straight to stack.

It would be nice to vent basement drain and toilet together as they are almost on top of each other in basement, but I don't think code allows it.

I am in rural South Dakota, not much you can't do here, but I would like to do this right.

Looking for venting diagram for venting position under cement floor.

Thanks,

LN

you can tie into the existing toilet vent but the connection must be 6 inches higher than the fixture it serves.
how you tie a vent into the new toilet drain can not be simply explained without actually seeing the conditions.

Got started today with new PVC. Using 4".

First thing was to glue a new 4" cleanout at stub. Proceeded by installing a short piece of 4" pipe followd by a sanatary T 4" 4" 2". Added a short piece of 2" to this T. Glued on a 2" Wye for drain vent followed by a Sioux Drain with p trap and built in cleanout. Has proper slope.

Back to main drain. Added another foot of 4" PVC followed by a 4" 4" 3" swept T for basement toilet. Added about a 1' piece of pipe to this followed bay a 3" 3" 2" Wye for vent. Stubbed in another short piece after measuring to 12" from wall for toilet. Have not glued 90 on end yet for toilet. Wanted to make sure it is were it is supposed to be vertically for concrete. Slope for this 3' to 3.5' is between 3/4" and 1".

The stack will go next at about 16 inches. Some folks are recommending a swept 90 for the bottom of stack. Is this necessary? I have one with a 4" going out the back I was thinking about plugging for something in future? Will this pose a problem in the future? I also have a standard 4" 4" 90?

This is all being done in very close quarters in an old "dungeonous" basement. No pun intended.

LN

post a picture for further advice. it sounds like the floor drain is not vented.. flushing the toilet could syphon the 2" trap.

Floor drain has a Wye for venting as well, added per advice here. Will be running both parrallel to the wall under future concrete and up. These will be about 1' apart. Can I join here and continue on "2"" to stack vent, keeping in mind to integrate some upward slope. Some say flat others would like to see upward slope. Can't miss with a little upward slope probably?

THX
LN

Take a look. The toilet run is cut off. Also, wonder if a pure sweep is more efficient than this 4x4x4 sweep in photo that is not hooked up yet?

Thanks,

LN

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no need for the extra inlet. just use a 4 x 3 elbow..

I did go with 4", so you mean a 4" x 4" elbow? And use a 4" elbow instead of a long 4" sweep?

Thanks,

LN

Thanks for everyone's help here.

LN



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