I have the 'old style' Valley single handled shower faucet original to my 1979 home. The original problem was a significant leak that sprayed out from around or behind the Bonnet Nut when you turned the faucet on, but the water did turn off when the stem was in the off position. I replaced the seats, springs and cartridge using like parts from the local big box hardware store. Now the problem has changed - no water sprays from the bonnet nut, but the water won't turn off. The cartridge front is a triangle and even when the stem is fully positioned straight down into the V, the water continues to run from the tub spout to the tune of a 40lb cat litter bucket about every 10 minutes, YIKES! I have had to turn off my water to the house.

I think, after looking at a diagram of the parts schematic found online, that the problem may be the adjustment nut that sinks into the bonnet nut opening. The old one seems brittle and perhaps stripped as I have taken the whole shebang off and on so many times. The water flow changes when tightening this nut but never turns off and doesn't seem right to me when tigtening it. The local stores don't carry this part or have any personnel that know squat about squat, so I am hoping that I can find some help here!!

The other solution may be that I did not install the seats and springs correctly. The seats purchased locally looked slightly different from the ones removed from behind the cartridge, and again, the online drawings are not detailed enough.

Many grateful thanks in advance for anyone's sage advice!!

DIYBlonde

I May Be Dumb, But I’m Not Blonde!



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It is very doubtful that the cam ring adjustment is at fault. With a leak like what you describe, I think that you need to have a second look at the seal/spring installation. Did you save the old springs? Chances are, they are not the same as the new springs that came with the kit. The old style were long and straight, not cone-shaped. If so, try reusing them with the new seals (the springs don't wear out) and see if that makes any difference.

Valley never use a cone shaped spring. It sounds like the seat and springs are wrong or not installed correctly. Starting from the top there is a cup shaped washer (which pushes against the bottom of the cartridge), then a little white plastic piece, and then the spring. The plastic piece slides inside the spring. If you bought Delta or Peerless seats and springs, dump then and get some Valley.

The proper "washers" look like small barrels, the springs are long and straight, with white nylon inserts for the springs. if yours were not like that, or installed in the wrong order the water will not turn off.

If he has conical springs, then he also probably has Delta rubber seals and they do NOT work in a Valley faucet.

Thanks everyone! I did buy springs and seats that look like the old ones - spring longer than width and same width at ends, seats that look like a little oil barrel - and marked for use in old style Valley single handled faucets.

They were installed with the white insert then spring then seat in that order from the valve. Perhaps with all our put it in and take it out again something has happened.

I know we had it right at some point because the faucet only previously leaked when turned on, gushing from the bonnet nut but turned off completely when stem down. Now nothing from the bonnet, but won't turn off.

On the last try, the bonnet adjustment ring (plastic inserted and screwed down into bonnet) seemed to be able to find a sweet spot where the water almost turned off - and that was not in the full off stem position of down to the bottom of the V - but that adjustment didn't hold and eventually we could not find either that sweet spot or find any position where the water would turn off. In fact, the more I moved the stem around, the more water came out no matter where the stem was.

I'm so frustrated with it all, I want to dye my hair!! But since I've had to turn off the water to the house, I can't rinse out the dye!! (all the blonde stuff is joking of course!)



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Okay, so reading this all again a few times, I ask:

The order of the seats and springs is what? I inserted the spring onto the white plastic piece and put the seat over that which means that from the valve I have 1. the white plastic with the lipped end up against the valve, 2. the spring in the middle and 3. the black rubber seat against the cartridge. IS THIS THE RIGHT ORDER? Does the white plastic piece go INSIDE the seat? Does the spring actually go INTO the little holes on the valve?

Again, many thanks for helping. I've already paid the plumber sent by the home warranty person $125 and he said "parts are not available anymore" so he took his money and left! So I kind of gave up for a while. But I have too many people coming in and out of my bedroom for showers! I want my shower back! And I want to accomplish this myself!

DIYBlonde



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seal on top
spring in middle
white plastic

1. Which home warranty company has a $125.00 deductible? I have never had to pay more than$65.00, and when I did work for one I only collected $75.00 maximum. IF they do not perfomr a service, they should not collect the deductible, and if you complain to the warranty company they may refund if they are a reputable company, OR send a better plumber who DOES know how to fix it. Parts ARE STILL AVAILABLE if they know what they need.

(Site rules seem to suggest I can't name names, but it's one of the biggies who advertise as if they really care about a homeowners dilemas) I picked the higher deductible/lower monthly premium as I didn't think I'd need them too often. One contractor told me the deal - if they spend too much - ie. more than the deductible - they get called less for jobs. So if they can minimize the cost of the repair it's in their best interest for future jobs. Stinks, but I really only wanted it in case my original a/c or forced air heat goes out. We weren't able to fix the shower so I called them. Jokes on me as he wouldn't/couldn't fix it and it cost me $125 to find that out.

Yes, I complained but it was a waste of my time as the home warranty team who listens to complaints are not really listening and don't give a hoot.



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Well thank you! We checked again tonight and they are indeed in that order with the black seats headed towards the valve body. All seems right there. So I'm back to WTHeck is wrong?

I did notice that when I pull the stem down to the off position, the water flow ends for a fraction of a second as it hits the bottom and then poof! it's pouring out again.

Even when the house water is turned off, water runs (a steady stream but much less volume) from the tub spout, and the water is quite warm, as an even mixture of hot and cold is escaping through the valve. It seems as if the bottom of the V is not really the bottom at all and the whole thing is tilted down so that the stem never really reaches bottom. But it doesn't look that way, it just acts that way.

Oh, whoa is me!!



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YOU need a better company in that case. I could NEVER do a job for the deductible because my base fee is higher than that. BUT, I always did the job. When my own water heater had to be replaced, I paid the deductible, but when the company tried to "upgrade" the installation with a lot of 'extras', they paid me to install it myself and then returned my deductible amount also, since the company had not done anything. There is almost nothing hard about a Valley faucet repair. You install the springs and seals properly, then put the cartridge on top of them and tighten the cap. If it still leaks you have some defective part, although I have never had it happen.

Is there a way that the cartridge can be installed 180* out of sync? (Then the handle would act in reverse as well.......).

I had a home warranty company blow me off and my realtor called them. She said she wouldn't sell their product in that branch anymore and would use a competitor. Home warranty company then fixed the problem double quick and did so free of further charges and no complaints.

I've been in this home 16 years and had the original (with sale) home warranty for about 7 years, but cancelled as I only used a couple of times. About two years ago I signed up again as, if my heater or a/c goes - and they are original to 1979 house - I'll not have the money to replace. So no realtor involved.

Nope, as the stem opening is in the shape of a triangle with the 90 degree flat side at the top and the V bottom is the off position. Sure I've got that right, well 99%.

Alright, I went to the box store and got another set of seats and springs and they don't look exactly like the ones you pictured. The springs are the same, approximately 5 twists not including the ends, and the little white things are the same, but the black seats look like the ones in this amazon link with the exterior rings pushed to one end:

[www.amazon.com]

In addition, if you look at them on each end, one is fully open (the end with the rings on the outside) and the other end is narrower as if there is a slight bezel in the end.

QUESTION - which end is inserted first into the valve? I INSTALLED THEM with the wider opening first which, on the outside is where the exterior "rings" are. I tried both, but the spring/white thing combo would not stay unless I sort of threaded it into the narrower opening so the whole thing would stay put while I installed the cartridge over it.

(Just so you know, I took the advice of some post I've seen somewhere to turn on the water and blow any debris out of the valve prior to installing the afore mentioned parts. In the time it took to run down the stairs and out the door, do a full turn on the water wheel, and run back up the stairs, I had flooded the bathroom as the water shot directly to the wall at the other end of the tub and went everywhere! So funny! What a nice clean floor I have now! But I digress....)

So, now they are all installed, and who the heck knows if it's right, and wa-la! the water leak is down to a trickle!!! Still a bit more than a drip, so still something amiss, but better.

ANY IDEAS ANYONE?

BTW - I shall now be know as DIY (Determined I Yam) Blonde



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NO! There is a tab on the side that fits into a recess on the valve body. This is such a simple repair that I cannot figure out what is happening to it.

I am "well ahead" of my warranty company, what with a new AC, new pool filter, pool pump motors, water heater, etc.

Wish I was in that good shape! I'd love to replace or repair everything - and the list is long - but just raised and put two through college on my own. The somewhat tarnished but still silver lining is that home values are high in my area and even if I spent fifty grand on the house, I wouldn't get it back in a sale. Moot point as I don't have it anyway! Even so, Very Happy to live here in the USA, have a home, two incredible kids and good friends. Life is good and regardless of the little annoyances and setbacks, I am grateful.

Alright, NOW I've ordered what are billed as GENUINE Valley seats and springs online as well as a new cartridge, a new bonnet nut, and new adjustment ring. Hopefully it will get here before my next water bill.

And perhaps the instructions will be very clear as to the order and orientation of the seats, springs and white do-hicky. I get what order but which end first of each component (except the spring obviously) towards the valve for the seat and whether I have the right spring length or not, yada-yada, will help immensely. Too bad I doubt getting good instructions as everything I've purchased so far has instructions prepared for people who already know how to do it and diagrams so small and lacking in detail as to be useless. The instruction writer does not stop and consider each and every step and the pertinent questions that would be asked by a novice. Reminds me of my first video camera that was accompanied by instructions written in English by someone who obviously only spoke Japanese...


Wish Me Luck!!

Determined I Yam Blonde



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Good luck!

More Research:

This link shows a good representation of the bonnet nut and the adjustment nut:

[www.amazon.com]

My adjustment nut is soooo worn out that it barely has notches on the side, so I'm glad I've ordered a new one, even if "the gang" isn't convinced it will help.


This link shows the differences in the polar ends of the black seats I have:

[www.amazon.com]

Hence one of my questions - which end goes into the valve?


I will get there, have no doubt!!

DIYBlonde



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I am not sure how you can get "genuine" Valley parts because they went out of business decades ago.

The end that the spring slides into is the bottom.

The plumbing supply website I ordered from identified the seats and springs item as 'genuine valley'. Now why would they do that if it weren't so? Old stock perhaps? Rendered from original molds? Who knows? I just hope they work!!

DIYBlonde

So far, no one has said exactly which end of a seat the spring 'slides into.' And as the whole contraption sits on it's side, I am not sure what is meant by 'the bottom.'

What would be great is a written schematic of assembly in order (then I can 'see' it go together in my mind):

• Valve, holes facing the right (as I sit on the edge of my tub, I look to the left and the valve is in the hole in the wall facing to the right)
• Seats positioned in each hole, larger opening facing left (or right), or, sink larger (or smaller) holed end of seat into valve opening first
• Spring
• White Do-hicky, flat base on right and barrel/stem inserted into spring to the left
• Cartridge with stem facing right inserted to right of Valve and Seats assembly matching tab to tab slot on valve
• Adjusting Ring seated on cartridge on right end
• Bonnet Nut slid over and onto cartridge from right to left, and hand tightened
• Adjusting Ring tightened to sufficient pressure to seat cartridge against valve (and stop the leak)

Somewhere in this I don't have it right, but the instructions must leave No Doubt about the orientation of each piece of the puzzle for this novice handygirl.

I would certainly be way out of line asking for a picture!! But if you happen to have one...

DIYBlonde

thicker part faces up. or.. side with 2 ridges goes in first..

I don't know how you are describing the seats, but one end has a larger opening that the spring fits into. "bottom" is relative to the hole in the faucet as if it were a "well" in the ground.

Hmmm, Interesting!

When I tried it that way, with the larger opening facing 'up' or the top, the spring (with white thing inserted in top) had nothing to hold to and would fall out. I could find no way to secure it while putting the cartridge back. So that is why I reveresed the seat in the valve as I was able to sort of thread the spring into the smaller opening when facing the top and then it would stay put. Didn't seem right but was the only way to keep it from falling out of the valve opening.

Perhaps ALL of the various springs I have purchased that say 'for Valley' are too narrow? Would a wider spring stay put in the seat?

see: [plumbing.about.com]

the principle is the same for a shower valve

use an allen key/wrench to hold assembly together

The plastic insert goes into the spring on the bottom and the rubber seal goes on the top. (the spring will go INTO the rubber seal) Both seats and seat openings are the same.

Slide the three pieces onto a screwdriver to keep them in position while you push them evenly into the slot in the faucet body. Push them into place all the way down with your finger. They should stick up just a bit but spring down when you push on them.

The white plastic end goes into the hole first !

==============================================

"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638



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Thank you! I have them installed in another order. Going to go home after work and try again!

DIYBlonde

you place the spring and white piece in the valve FIRST, then you push the rubber seals on to them.

Yahoooeeee!! It Is FIXED !!!

Thank You to all of you folks (I'm thinking guys) who contributed to this thread and helped me to put this to bed. I am grateful to each and every one of you!

What a learning experience, and learn I did. Getting the springs, seats and thing-a-ma-jigs in the correct order was most of the battle. Got those in right, but then... off was on and on was off - I knew something was still wrong and was sure it would fail again. What I found was the back most piece of the cartridge was not flat against the middle piece when inserted into its place and it spun 180 degrees making on off and off on. Once I got it flat against the back and carefully inserted as to not cause it to move, then continued with the bonnet nut IT NO LONGER LEAKED AND SHUT OFF COMPLETELY IN THE OFF POSITION! Oh Happy Day! (I get my shower back)

LOVE This Forum and appreciate all the professionals who take the time to help others. I am heavily involved in community service and I hope the joy and good feelings I get from contributing to my community are felt by all of you as well, for what you do here is truly community service.

I’m feeling more positive about doing more home maintenance myself so I’ll soon ask about my Valley sink faucet that spins and spins, turning from on to off somewhere in the rotation… Stay Tuned and again, My Most Sincere Thanks!!

DIYBlonde



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You are most welcome.

We were glad to help !

==============================================

"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638

quote; I’m feeling more positive about doing more home maintenance myself so I’ll soon ask about my Valley sink faucet that spins and spins, turning from on to off somewhere in the rotation…

That is the problem with telling you how to fix one faucet.

A Valley sink faucet would normally be the same as your tub valve and not "spin", unless it has two handles and then you either need a new handle or a new cartridge, depending on which piece broke. If your have a two handle faucet with "round" handles, then a Delta handle will replace it if you cannot find a Valley one. Delta lever handles will NOT interchange, however.



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Yup, that is a definite problem for sure!! But I know I can do it!

My Valley faucets are the three piece - two offset 25 cent plastic crystal (dirt/crud collecting) handles and one lone spout in the middle - type. One side leaks when on from the somewhere near the counter top and the other handle keeps going round and round and never hits a stop but you can find an off and an on somewhere in the rotation. I just KNOW that will eventually deteriorate into a bigger problem... in the middle of the night sometime or when I have guests!

Probably seats, springs, thing-a-ma-jigs and cartridges for both (I say with such authority now that it only took me five days and a dozen or more tries to fix my shower!) If you have more advice, please share!

Many more thanks!

DIYBlonde



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The stop in the handle has probably cracked off. Are they lever or round handles?

They are the round plastic crystal type.

=^..^=

In that case you can use Delta handles if you cannot find Valley handles.

The white plastic part goes in at either end of the spring. The rubber seat can go on top of the spring. The rubber seat The plastic seat should be at the far end of the hole and the rubber part should be at the hole opening. You can use something with a diameter smaller than the rubber seat to push it in so it doesn't pop out. You may succeed in pressing it in with your finger. First, put only the two pieces of the cartridge in by making sure the apex of the triangle where the two holes are is at the bottom. This will align the holes in the cartridge with the rubber seats. Then make sure the plastic tab on the second piece of the cartridge is aligned with the notch in the metal. push these two parts in until the plastic tab is flush with the notch or close to it. Now place the third piece of the cartridge (it can only go one way). Put silicon grease on the bonnet nut threads so it is easy to put on and remove. I forgot to mention that silicon grease should also be put on the rubber seats and the O-ring of the cartridge. Now, close it by putting on the bonnet nut. Hand tighten it as much as possible, then use the wrench but do not overtighten it. Good luck!