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Author:
sum (FL)
I have been around this forum for a few years now and have learned a lot from everyone and now I know enough to be dangerous.
Mostly I will do my own work without permit, but I am OCD so I will make sure I do it right, you guys are my inspectors, as my local inspectors are much less knowledgeable. I comply with code, but I wanted to know the reasons behind the code and I am sometimes horrified the inspectors are ignorant of that.
But last week I had to get a permit, because the previous owner added a bar illegally and got caught, there is a violation recorded and I need to clear it, and I am required to hire a plumbing contractor for the water and drain removal.
So the plumber I hired came to terminate the bar water line and drain. Basically cut off the PVC pipe at the wall stubout, and glued a PVC cap on, cut the 1/2" copper and solder on a cap. Total bill $750 and I bet $650 of it was for the permitting paperwork.
But watching him work, a master plumbing of 30 years, he cleaned, fluxes the copper cap and pipe, then applied heat with his torch, after some time he put the solder on the joint WHILE the torch was still on the joint, and of course the solder melted but I can't tell if the joint was hot enough for the solder to take. I thought you are supposed to back the torch off and test with the solder. However I am also willing to accept may be he has done this for so long he knew when to apply without backing it off.
Afterwards he turned water on and it didn't leak.
The inspector came, passed the permit, so I am good.
After that, I walked over to the room behind the bar, where the bar drain and supply run to the actual sanitary tee and supply manifold, and disconnected there myself. So yes, all that $ spent was totally redundant to pass the inspection, I didn't want the plumbing inspector to see I had the wall opened on the other side to do my own electrical work.
Shhhhhhhh....
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Author:
bernabeu (SC)
the 'olden times' code prohibited dead ends over 24" - period, end of case
reason:
potable - stagnant dead end for bacteria to breed
sanitary - 'build up' point
==============================================
"Measure Twice & Cut Once" - Retired U.A. Local 1 & 638
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Author:
packy (MA)
I thought you are supposed to back the torch off and test with the solder. However....
well, sort of..
back the torch up but not off.
try to have the torch hold the temperature constant. not too hot but don't let the joint prematurely cool either.
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Author:
sum (FL)
Well there may be a 24" max dead end the inspector didn't say anything. He didn't ask, the plumber didn't ask, nor even attempted to find out where things branched off. I knew because before I bought it I already mapped the vents in the roof and knew where the drain goes, the water supply I didn't know because it could be in the wall or up the attic going who knows where.
I had the wall opened up to fix the electrical mess and happened to see the supply manifold there, but I didn't want them to see that side.
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Author:
sum (FL)
I am in Alaska hahaha.
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Author:
sum (FL)
Packy that's what I meant when I said "back off" was to move the flame away from the joint still on, and use the solder to touch the joint and watch it draws the solder in by itself without the torch. He kept the torch on the joint and that's what puzzled me. It didn't leak. I don't know if he got lucky, or may be he is so experienced he knew when its hot enough even in his sleep.
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Author:
hj (AZ)
I do it the same way. I apply the torch to the fitting, and then test with the solder until it flows. Then just make the joint and THEN remove the torch from the fitting.
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Author:
OldHouse1959 (NV)
Forgive my ignorance, but what is a "dead end", and does that "olden time" code still apply today?
And is it equally to supply lines as well as drain?
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My guess of what a 'dead end' might be has got me wondering if I don't have a temporary one.
I have a washer and laundry tub horizontal 2" drain, and left an additional 32" uphill from the vertical drain from the washer P trap, in anticipation of adding a vanity sink another 3 feet up from that point.
The additional 32" is also tied into the vent system right at the end, again in preparation for a future vanity uphill 3' from that point. The end point is capped off with a rubber plug with wing nut at the end.
Is that considered a "dead end", and if so, is it ok to leave it that way for an indefinate period of time?
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Author:
KCRoto (MO)
The dead ends that are referred to above are talking about water supply lines, not drain lines. Runs of water supply pipe that stand full of water will get stagnant and can breed bacteria. If I recall correctly, it is legionnaires that is the concern. Drain and vent lines can be capped indefinitely.
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Author:
hj (AZ)
The dead ends he is referring to are in the water system, not the drain lines.
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Author:
KCRoto (MO)
The additional 32" is also tied into the vent system right at the end, again in preparation for a future vanity uphill 3' from that point. The end point is capped off with a rubber plug with wing nut at the end.
Is that considered a "dead end", and if so, is it ok to leave it that way for an indefinate period of time?
are you sure? I haven't seen an expansion plug in a water supply line.
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