I am trying to install an island with a faucet in my kitchen. I do not know how to do the venting. I would appreciate anyone who did it before would share his/her experience. Thanks.

Use an AAV if permitted and acceptable to you. Otherwise search for older threads on "island vent" and you should get some links to nice diagrams.

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Links to the State of Wisconsin Plumbing Code:
[docs.legis.wisconsin.gov]
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I am not a plumber.
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Thanks for the reply. What does AAV mean and how to apply it? Thanks.

It is a poor choice for a real vent, they are prone to leakage and odor problems. They are commonly used in mobile home trailers. It is a device with a rubber valve that will allow air to enter a pipe providing protection for the trap seal. when the rubber valve fails it no longer is a one way valve and sewer gases will escape under the sink. It should be used only as a vent of last resort. Use an island sink vent if at all possible.

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Since 1995 (3 years before Google started) PlumbingSupply.com has been THE best plumbing supplier on the web. Please visit our sponsor [www.PlumbingSupply.com]

Here is an updated picture of an island vent.




Edited 1 times.

That's a really good picture of a island/loop vent. It would be "ideal" if there was another cleanout access in the vertical vent going up the wall. Consider a clog in the horizontal main waste...everything is backing up everywhere in that scenario and when it all releases....that flat vent will hold waste with no way to remove it, heading towards the wall.

My recommendation would be to size that piping in 2" from the tee serving the trap and strap that 2" every 2' so sagging doesn't happen over time. This consideration basically over long horizontal runs mainly.



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Red,is that why tornadoes hit mobile home trailer parks....there not vented properly?

Yes the improper venting sucks the tornados right in! Plus they know with all the code violations they are easy prey! Nature often preys on the weak.

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Since 1995 (3 years before Google started) PlumbingSupply.com has been THE best plumbing supplier on the web. Please visit our sponsor [www.PlumbingSupply.com]

This illustration shows an appropriately placed clean-out fitting and pipe sizing.



e-plumber
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"The society which scorns excellence in Plumbing as a humble activity and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an
exalted activity will have neither good Plumbing nor good philosophy: neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water." -
John William Gardner 10/8/1912 - 2/16/2002

Repair your leaking Plumbing fixtures ASAP [www.theplumber.com]
This slow drip will waste 7+ gallons of water per day.

Another mistery solved......Bet you there "Global warming" Tornadoes too.



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Some cities in this area require 2" for everything beneath the floor, including the foot vent.

Okay......I like e-plumber's diagram because it has the correctly placed cleanout to cover the foot (flat) vent that I know gets clogged over time.

Except I would put the cleanout above the san T. I'm going to modify that other pic and also include the c.o. on the foot vent.

Thank you all for your help. I have a very idea how to install the island sink now. Today I went to the city hall and asked the inspector about AAV. He told me he would not approve it. Besides, after what Red said about AAV, I do not want it anyway.

I'm wondering if 'he' would not approve it or does the Plumbing code specify that AAV's are not permitted, (according to the written local code)...

An atmospheric vent is superior by far, practially nothing can go wrong with it.

e-plumber
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"The society which scorns excellence in Plumbing as a humble activity and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an
exalted activity will have neither good Plumbing nor good philosophy: neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water." -
John William Gardner 10/8/1912 - 2/16/2002

Repair your leaking Plumbing fixtures ASAP [www.theplumber.com]
This slow drip will waste 7+ gallons of water per day.

AAV's will be approved in the next version of the UPC, but for now they are a local option.

I do not know whether it is the state of California, or the city code would not permit AAV. When I asked the inspector about AAV, he immediately said he would not approve it.

I know it's much easier to install AAV than island sink venting. Even nothing bad would happen with AAV, I guess the inspector pretty much dictates how I must do it, if I were going to pass inspection

"Even nothing bad would happen with AAV"

Not true. Under certain conditions an AAV can cause its own set of problems, such as not draining with the AAV installed, but does drain when it is removed.



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That is going to be a sad development for the plumbing industry, and a unhealthy one at that.


Plumbing for the most part in regards to the end user, it's "put it in and forget it" and not deal with any expense unless it is leaking or causing damage.


The situation with AAV's is that when they fail, they become hidden whether it be the way it was installed *concealed in a wall* or the rubber diaphragm ripples like a toilet flapper and doesn't seal out the flow of sewer gases. Folks, sewer gases are a transmission of airborne bacteria and other nasty stuff that causes prolonged illnesses.

These hidden issues can crop some dangerous situations otherwise eliminated by properly vented systems that include piping arrangements that send all gases/harmful vapors to the outside of the structure. We are taking mobile home logic and putting it inside of permanent, well built structures.

I'd like to hear Vic's take on this matter.

"I guess the inspector pretty much dictates how I must do it, if I were going to pass inspection"

Not necessarily true. The inspector can only enforce the written Plumbing code, including any written amendments to the code. Technically s/he is not allowed to enforce selectively but on the other hand if you fight them, it may end up being a losing battle in the long run

e-plumber
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The society which scorns excellence in Plumbing as a humble activity and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an
exalted activity will have neither good Plumbing nor good philosophy: neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water." -
John William Gardner 10/8/1912 - 2/16/2002

Repair your leaking Plumbing fixtures ASAP [www.theplumber.com]
This slow drip will waste 7+ gallons of water per day.

Just to make sure I don't quote you wrong...
"It is a poor choice for a real vent, they are prone to leakage and odor problems. They are commonly used in mobile home trailers. It is a device with a rubber valve that will allow air to enter a pipe providing protection for the trap seal. when the rubber valve fails it no longer is a one way valve and sewer gases will escape under the sink. It should be used only as a vent of last resort. Use an island sink vent if at all possible."
You must be thinking of a ProVent; a spring loaded, mechanical device that will fail. ProVents are commonly used in trailers.
Code approved AAV's, such as Ayrlett or even Studor, undergo rigorous testing that spans/represents the life of a housing plumbing system. The rubber valve does NOT fail. There is NO leakage and odor problems. We have NEVER had a problem with an AAV going bad due to the AAV failing. It is how they are installed (not following the manufacturer's instructions).



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"We have NEVER had a problem with an AAV going bad due to the AAV failing"

I have. A toilet wasn't flushing properly in a large warehouse that I take care of. It was discovered that a (malfunctioning) AAV was the problem. Once the AAV was removed, the toilet flushed perfectly. Since an atmospheric vent was put in, (years ago), no problems at all.

Anything mechanical will eventually fail, let's face the facts.

e-plumber
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The society which scorns excellence in Plumbing as a humble activity and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an
exalted activity will have neither good Plumbing nor good philosophy: neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water." -
John William Gardner 10/8/1912 - 2/16/2002

Repair your leaking Plumbing fixtures ASAP [www.theplumber.com]
This slow drip will waste 7+ gallons of water per day.

I went to the ayrlett site and through the pathway of that device, the first clog would clog that device easily without effort.

There's a big difference between lab testing and field testing and there is no way to replicate the various situations that plumbing systems become involved in.

Take it from those who know (plumbers) that deal with these devices and everyday situations than somebody who poses as a talking head for a product "that never fails".

Another internet sales tactic that fails miserably amoungst those who know better.

The problem with not flushing with the AAV installed, but working with an atmospheric vent is almost always caused by a drain/sewer problem, not a malfunctioning AAV. Since a toilet will flush better without a vent the nonfunctional AAV would improve the flush, not prevent it. The problem is caused when air is trapped between the toilet and a flooded sewer line. The properly operating AAV cannot expel the air, while an atmospheric vent will allow the overpressure to be relieved.

That makes sense but there wasn't a clogged drain line.
I posted about this a while ago, the building manger called their normal drain cleaning co. to auger the toilet, no good. They lifted the toilet and snaked the line, no good. They even went as far as replacing the toilet, no good.

I was called in and found that the toilet drain was 'vented' with an AAV in another rental space on the other side of the wall. Once I removed the AAV, the toilet flushed great, time after time. I installed a real vent and it's been fine ever since.

e-plumber
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The society which scorns excellence in Plumbing as a humble activity and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an
exalted activity will have neither good Plumbing nor good philosophy: neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water." -
John William Gardner 10/8/1912 - 2/16/2002

Repair your leaking Plumbing fixtures ASAP [www.theplumber.com]
This slow drip will waste 7+ gallons of water per day.

the avv's are mechanical devices. they can not be installed in a concealed location because they are prone to failure. i have run into more than a few bad aav's. just like eplumber said, i ran a real vent and has not had a problem since ad i had run a snake before deciding to replace

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PLUMBERS "Protecting The Health Of The Nation"

My original statement still stands. There was air trapped in the line for some reason. An AAV cannot let air out, but an atmospheric vent can.

"The rubber valve does NOT fail. There is NO leakage and odor problems. We have NEVER had a problem with an AAV going bad due to the AAV failing. It is how they are installed (not following the manufacturer's instructions)."

And I've got a bunch of "Oceanfront Property" in Montana I'll give you a helluva deal on...

I think HJ's got a few parcels down in Arizona to check with him!

I do agree with HJ on the trapped air issue. Might be fighting a sag!

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Since 1995 (3 years before Google started) PlumbingSupply.com has been THE best plumbing supplier on the web. Please visit our sponsor [www.PlumbingSupply.com]

I do agree with HJ on the trapped air issue. Might be fighting a sag!

Good decision. The race is not always to the swift, or the battle to the strong, but that is the way the smart money always bets.

"Winning or losing the battles is not important, it is winning the WAR that matters in the long run."

...All I know is that I won the WAR against a non-flushing toilet by replacing an AAV with a real vent

e-plumber
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"The society which scorns excellence in Plumbing as a humble activity and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an
exalted activity will have neither good Plumbing nor good philosophy: neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water." -
John William Gardner 10/8/1912 - 2/16/2002

Repair your leaking Plumbing fixtures ASAP [www.theplumber.com]
This slow drip will waste 7+ gallons of water per day.

That is why we like atmospheric vents and do not like AAV's. They cause their own unique problems.

You will find this concensous to be much more clear here than the putty vs. silicone debate! Some things don't matter much and it goes on and on. AAV's most here will agree they are a vent of last resort.

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Since 1995 (3 years before Google started) PlumbingSupply.com has been THE best plumbing supplier on the web. Please visit our sponsor [www.PlumbingSupply.com]