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 removal of steel flange from CI bell
Author: JakeDog

I have a 4" CI bell that has a leaded in steel flange. The flange extends out about 3/4" from the bell -- not really enough surface to clamp to.

I need to connect to PVC to the CI for the toilet waste line connection.

I've got pics of the existing plumbing @ [tinyurl.com]. The CI bell with steel flange is best illustrated by the pic in the second row, first column.

Any ideas on how to remove the steel flange? I'm thinking of taking my air grinder to it and cut it out. The flange extends into the bell about 3".

Thanks for any thoughts, ideas, advice.


To be or not to be, is true. -- G. Boole

Edited 1 times.

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 Re: removal of steel flange from CI bell
Author: packy (MA)

jake, code wise, you have some serious issues here. the vanity has no vent and the toilet vent is flat. one big problem with older, existing plumbing layouts is trying to get them to comply with current codes.
to answer your question, a 4" no-hub coupling has the stainless steel clamps at the very outside edges. it clamps tightly onto the first 3/4 to 1" of pipe. it's a close call, but it looks like you may have enough to grab onto.
the best thing i would do to get you closer to code would be to cut a 4x2 no hub "TY" into the horizontal vent stack and drain the vanity into it. this would do 2 things. vent the vanity and the vanity draining water would "wash" the flat toilet vent. (wet vent for toilet)
the next issue is, the shower drain needs to be 2". they make rubber donuts that you lubricate and insert the pipe and donut into the hub, tap with a hammer and it's done.

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 Re: removal of steel flange from CI bell
Author: hj (AZ)

That piece should be brass, because they should not have been able to "wipe" a solder joint between the lead bend and a cast iron/steel pipe. If you can do it without burning the building down, you can just melt the lead and the piece will pull out. Then you can lead/oakum a new cast iron closet bend into the hub. How did you ever seal the PVC into that hub? (and the PVC elbow at the hub is the wrong one for that point.)

Edited 1 times.

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 Re: removal of steel flange from CI bell
Author: JakeDog

Thanks guys -- I want to make this plumbing situation as correct and as functional as possible. The house was built in '28 and the previous owner (yep, only one) did some funky things around here. I call them DPOs :-)

I'm not real comfortable putting a flame down there to melt the lead -- its pretty close quarters, flamable and this whole deal is right above my wife's new kitchen :-) I'll pick up a coupling clamp and see how well it does the job. If that doen't look feasible, I'll get comfortable with melting it out . . . how hot of a flame do I need? Anything more than propane?

The CI from the vertical stack to the wye for the toilet is pitched about 1/2" from the stack elbow to the wye -- does mitigate the situation at all?

My plan, as packy suggests, is to install a TY into the stack for the vanity drain. A couple questions about this:

o Do I also need to install a TY above the fill line of the vanity for a vent?

o This means that I'll cap off and abandon the existing PVC drain -- any issues with this plan? [hj -- From what I can tell that PVC is epoxied into the bell (at least on the surface). If feels pretty solid, but I don't trust it. Yet another DPO]

Thanks also for the advice on the shower drain

Thanks for the advice guys -- let me know if you have any additional thoughts!!

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 Re: removal of steel flange from CI bell
Author: dlh (TX)

that looks like a piece of cast iron in there. you might be able to cut it (dremel or titainimum saws-all blade) and break it. then just pry the lead and oakum out

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PLUMBERS "Protecting The Health Of The Nation"

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 Re: removal of steel flange from CI bell
Author: packy (MA)

if you want to remove the piece from the hub, just drill a bunch of 1/4" holes into the lead. make them as close to eachother as possible. the lead and oakum can be picked out and the piece should pop right out.
the center of the branch of the "TY" you cut into the stack should be about 18-20 inches off the finish floor level. you do not need to vent this back into the stack. it is what is called "stack vented". when i used the term ,flat vented, what i mean is a dry vent must rise at a 45deg angle until it is higher than the fixture it is venting. your toilet vent, even though it has a slight pitch, is considered a flat vent. by draining the sink into it, it becomes a wet vent and does not need to rise at a 45deg angle.
if the dry, flat vent becomes clogged, it will cease to function as a vent and you will never know. if the sink drains into it (wet vent), and it becomes clogged, you will know as the sink will not drain.
this is why,IMHO, a wet vent is preferable. cabeesh..

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 Re: removal of steel flange from CI bell
Author: JakeDog

Great! Thanks for the response.

I was able to clear out enough of the lead around the steel flange to get a SS coupling all of the way on it (the steel flange comes to the midpoint of the coupling).

I'll run the drainline for the lav as you prescribe!

Thanks again for the help! Very much appreciated!

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